HREOC Website: Isma - Listen: National consultations on eliminating prejudice against Arab and Muslim Australias

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|| Meeting Notes: 4 September 2003

Consultation hosted by the
Lebanese Community Council, Bankstown, 4 September 2003

The meeting was chaired by Ms Hind Kourouche,
Coordinator of the Council and attended by four other invited participants.
Omeima Sukkarieh and Meredith Wilkie (notes) attended from HREOC.

1. What are your experiences
of discrimination and vilification?

The meeting began by discussing the low incidence of
reporting of incidents and the reasons for it.

"Sometimes
it is reported but most of the time they never fill in a report; they
just dismiss it straight away."

"I really
don't think many people know who to complain to. That's another issue.
Most people will go to the police and they will complain but nothing
will get done about it. And they won't know what's happening. We've
got to look at what you can complain about and who to go to. It's not
just the police. There are other people and that's what you've really
got to make people aware of. Especially people who don't really speak
English. I don't think they really know where to go if they've been
discriminated against.”

The consultations and contacts undertaken by the Council
have led to the conclusion that:

"There
isn't much trust in the system that's saying ‘report to us'. So
therefore there's an immediate reluctance to report on those incidents.
Another thing is that the dynamics of the community are such that everything's
internal. They're not generous in their communication dialogue with
external bodies. Therefore a lot of things don't actually get addressed.
They're dealt with at the family level. They actually get eradicated
at the family level. It's too hard to take the initiative to log a call.
What they're more likely to do is, for example, come to a consultation
like this and talk about it but then it's no longer their problem; they've
dealt with it. So I agree: the helpline thing is not working well.”

A comparison was made with post 9/11 experiences in the
USA.

"During
my visit to the States I enquired with the Council for Arab Islam Relations
and they had quite a sufficient methodology where they were capturing
all of the statistics about the cases that had gone from the ground
all the way through to court. What they felt was that, while the police
had been harsh with the Arabic community and that other community members
were being harsh with the Arabic community, they actually felt that
when things went to the courts, the court was quite compassionate towards
Muslims. The courts were showing support and therefore there were a
lot of cases that were being won.

"What
was also interesting was that attacks on the hijab after 9/11 had reduced,
not increased in terms of discrimination, but the incidences were worse.”

"I used
to wear the scarf. I was working for [a State government agency]. [On
12 September 2001] I came into work and I hadn't heard what happened
the night before. When I came into work everybody was – their
eyes – I could feel it – just burning. I was like ‘What's
going on? Have I done something wrong?' One of the guys came over and
said ‘Did you have a look at the newspaper?' I had a look and
saw ‘September 11 – Two towers down' and I realised it was
the Muslims etc. So I had a look myself and I thought ok this is where
it's heading – I've been targeted. But there was no real discrimination.
But I could feel the heat. It just came from every side. Everyone was
just looking at me because I was the only person that was wearing the
scarf in the whole building. Whether I went down or up I could feel
the heat. I actually left in October when my traineeship finished. I
was only there for a month so I only had the heat on me for a month.

"It got
worse on the trains and it got worse in public – people looking
and swearing at you. Saying really bad stuff to you. My mother doesn't
speak very good English and I have to talk to her in Arabic. You can
imagine talking Arabic wearing a scarf and these people sitting across
from you and they're looking at you and thinking about September 11
and all this. And then just getting all these horrible remarks like
‘You wogs – go back to your own country'. ‘We brought
you here.' It's very hard – not only for me because I can understand
these people, what they're going through – but it's very hard
for my Mum because she doesn't know. She's just a decent person.

"Once
we were walking in Bankstown and my Mum had her scarf pulled off and
spat on.”

"I put
the scarf on after 9/11 as a form of being an Aussie courageous young
woman. And nothing happened. People would smile at me and I'd smile
back.”

"On scarf
day I put on a scarf to go to work and a lady stopped me on Central
Station and said ‘Dear, you look lovely'.”

"Seriously,
they do compliment. I've had so many compliments. There are some areas
where you get good comments and other areas where you get targeted and
it's not a good feeling. When someone does say you look good, of course
you feel better. But it depends what geographical area you're in. At
Campbelltown for example you just hear of it, it's just so out there.
The community are not really educated and they don't know so much. They
just put other women down. It happens heaps. It just depends on education.
The social status is low and that's why you find so much prejudice in
these areas. But I've gone down to Bondi and I don't get the same reaction.”

"That's
right. It's a completely different reaction. Compared to Lakemba where
you're walking around you've got all these Muslims wearing a scarf,
when you go down to Bondi with 4 or 5 friends and everybody's just turning
around, just looking at you. It's something that they don't see every
day. It's something that they're not used to.”

"But
it's not such a negative look as compared to Campbelltown. They look
at you and then if you smile they smile back, say hello. In Campbelltown
you can't even smile. I smile but sometimes you have people who just
round back at you.”

"When
I wore the scarf I would deliberately go to places like Double Bay,
Circular Quay, and there's a lot of respect.”

"Four
or five years ago I used to live in Campbelltown and the racism was
horrific. The neighbours would throw rocks, bricks, beer bottles at
our house. At one time all our windows were shattered. I was at home
alone – I was about 12. I was really, really scared. We just had
glass shattering one after another. My parents called the police but
they couldn't identify who did it so they didn't do anything.”

HREOC asked whether the levels of fear and experiences
of abuse had dropped again after September 2001.

"Now
with the Iraqi War it's still a bit the same. After I left [that job]
I had a hard time getting a job because I was still wearing a scarf.
[It wasn't long after September 11 and] everything was still fresh.
Even now with the Iraqi War going on with the Americans and the Australians,
it is still very hard because my Mum still wears the scarf. So I'll
be with her – you can't really tell that I'm a Muslim girl –
but because I'm with my Mum and she's wearing the scarf it really identifies
her as being a Muslim. If she didn't wear the scarf nobody's going to
come up to her.”

"She
might if she looks Middle Eastern. Christian and Middle Eastern people
are actually being targeted. This type of insults it does happen. I've
heard heaps of incidents happening in the Campbelltown area. And severe
incidents, not just verbal abuse but physical abuse. It gets to the
point where they just feel so isolated. They go back to their home and
they lock themselves up. So, emotionally they feel so distressed.”

"Did
it drop after September 11? No, it didn't drop. Absolutely not.”

"Because
everything's still happening. You've still got the Iraqi War going.
And it's escalating; it's not stopping. Every time you hear on TV that
American troops are getting murdered and you hear about the bombings
and Indonesia and all these things and you start thinking, when is it
going to stop so we can have a bit of peace?”

"Our
research has shown that it's actually been quite consistent and if anything
it's been increasing. I believe after 9/11 it was a shock to the whole
community. But what came out of it was a lot of educational programs
and inter-faith dialogue. That was really quite positive because we
began to build friendships with other religions and ethnic organisations.
It opened the door for the cross-cultural and religious dialogue. But
after Bali it was such a significant attack that impacted all the work
we'd done over the previous year. The turning point was that we really
had to prove ourselves before we got the sympathy of the public. It
was so close to home and we were following [in the press] the individual
cases – it was very intimate. We believe from our research that
after 9/11 there was a significant bias but then that eased out but
after Bali there was no return because the public didn't quite give
us the sympathy. There's also actually quite a lot of fear in the [mainstream]
community and that fear is a propaganda that's been driven by certain
members of the government and media … There's a sense that a lot
of migrants come in and don't appreciate the country. There's that sense
of ‘We've let them in our door and rather than live with us they've
become our enemy'.”

HREOC
asked what the community workers advise their clients who are afraid
and lock themselves in their homes.

"Some
of them who live in Claymore or Campbelltown are actually scared to
come into the office to discuss what's happening. We call them on the
phone and they say ‘We can't come but we need help in relation
to so and so'. Just this week we had a network meeting for the Arabic
workers up in Campbelltown and this particular issue was addressed.
We had a case: what happened was that she was verbally abused so much
and her son said to her ‘Why don't you get the car plate number?'
So she wrote it down but the driver saw her doing it which escalated
the problems. Then she went to the police and reported it but he just
dismissed it and said ‘We can't do anything'. She came in to one
of the community workers' office and they took it forward. They reported
it back to the police. We've got links in the police force. We can speak
to the ECLO who can actually take that down.

"In general
what do I do? I try to talk to them emotionally because none of them
feel confident to go into the police to discuss it. No matter what I
say, no-one will just go. They don't feel that they would get justice
by talking to them. And they don't feel safe to actually come out.”

Funding contracts may not permit workers to make home
visits to clients. This worker had once suggested that she might accompany
clients so that they would feel safe but after she was herself badly verbally
abused she could not pursue that.

"It was
a bad incident. I just went back to the office and thought this was
just shocking.”

The decision of one participant to remove the scarf after
September 11 was described.

"I was
wearing the scarf ever since I was in Year 7. Even during school I was
discriminated against but that wasn't a big issue for me. But for me
to have to go to work and be discriminated against because I'm wearing
the scarf I don't think was fair. After I left [a traineeship in October
2001] I found it very, very difficult. I was unemployed for about two
years. Every job that I would go to I know that I've go the skills,
that I've got the experiences, I know what I've done at work in good
places. It would really, really surprise me to get a phone call telling
me that I didn't get the job. I was thinking to myself, why? I know
that I'm fit, that I can do this job. I know that I'm the best person
for it. I automatically knew what was the reason. Three months later,
when I took it off, I automatically got a job. It wasn't alright [to
remove it] – my parents were really against it. But my Mum and
my Dad are very understanding. We've been here for 20 years. So they're
very broad-minded. I told them what was going on and explained to them
that I needed to find work. And to find work this is what I had to do.
But at the beginning they were a bit shaky.”

"She's
an Australian. What she wears is her business. How she goes to work
is a woman's personal choice. But there was a lot of discrimination
in the workforce in relation to this. And again our research has shown
that women of Islamic background were the most discriminated against
in the workforce compared to the Jewish and Christian women.”

The inconsistencies and inherent racism in media reporting
were raised.

"The
media makes it really difficult as well. I remember when the gang rapes
first happened and the description of the bloke that did specifically
have ‘Middle Eastern Muslim'. When you look at that and you look
at other rape cases that have been in the news paper before, you would
never see, say, ‘Anglo-Saxon' and you wouldn't see that word ‘Christian'
in there. That's where the media is going wrong – identifying
people by their religion not just by the person that they are.”

"It also
gives the idea that Islam oppresses women; therefore it's an Islamic
idea to go out and rape.”

"The
dynamics internally within the Lebanese community was interesting again.
The Christian community no longer wanted to be recognised as being Lebanese.
They were Phoenicians all of a sudden. The relationship-building needs
a lot of work.”

The conversation later turned again to the causes of
the current anti-Arab and anti-Muslim prejudice in Australia.

"The
problem we have at the moment is a result of a policy which, over the
generations and over the years, has taken hold of the whole of Australian
society. Seven or so years ago we encountered the experience of Pauline
Hanson. She is a stooge of the Liberal Party. She was groomed in the
Liberal Party. We all heard and still remember the abuse she put over
every single migrant in this country. That's when the division began
within our society. Lebos, Arabs, Muslims, this that and the other were
outlawed. The funny part here is that John Howard and his party would
say to Pauline Hanson ‘you're out; we don't want you; we can do
without your racist thinking'. Then John Howard applies the very same
principle in his immigration and refugee policies. It burns my heart.
The small community associations are all cronies to the system. They
want to be photographed with someone like John Howard or Peter Costello.
And at the end of the day they want a bit of a handout. But are they
really working for their own well-being, their own existence in this
society? ... So what we are facing here is the very same racist policy
that the likes of Pauline Hanson exposed on the social scene ... Since
when were Muslims destroying this country or about to destroy this country
or about to do harm to this country? If anything – go by the history
- the Muslim community here in this country, the majority of which are
hard working people, they believe in the country that's given them peace,
given them harmony, given them good food, good freedom. That's why they've
given their heart out. Do you mean to tell me that there are no criminals
among the Anglo-Saxon element?”

"More
recent developments should also be mentioned. There was the terrorism
campaign and then the terrorism bill which was passed created a lot
of community concern. It didn't allow the crisis in racism to dissipate.
It just kept it going quite strong and quite active. Also now insurance
costs for mosques and synagogues or any public liability insurance for
a function with ‘Islam' or ‘Muslim' in the name is some
ridiculous amount. That's deepening the perceptions and concerns.”

2. What is being done to fight
anti-Arab and anti-Muslim prejudice and discrimination?

Community organisation strategies
and projects

"The Muslim Women's Network has recently received a Living
in Harmony grant to work with journalism students to try to improve the
knowledge of journalists because journalists know no more than the general
population.”

Government strategies and
projects

"The
NSW Police Service has recently begun sponsoring their Arab and Muslim
officers and staff to come together in open forums to address the cultural
behaviours and sensitivity of Arabs and Muslims; to discuss and debate
about what experiences they're having and why the Islamic community
is standing out. I'd like to see it go further and they invite non-Arab
and non-Muslim officers. In the West they consult members – 500
at a time – on how to raid (eg don't tread over their prayer mat),
how to handle Muslim women etc etc. To provide that cultural understanding.
The Lebanese Community Council was the only organisation invited as
a guest organisation and I was asked to talk to them as well [at a forum
in June or July 2003].”

3. What more could be done
to fight anti-Arab and anti-Muslim prejudice and discrimination?

The meeting proposed the following strategies for achieving
some of the objectives identified by the Isma project.

Promoting positive public
awareness and challenging stereotypes

HREOC asked what kind of community education strategies
might work in a place like Campbelltown to reduce the prejudice the group
described?

"I would
say to get the Arabic community and the police involved together in
some sort of leisure activities so that way they won't be scared of
authority. Also to get the whole community as a whole to participate
in some situations. That way you could maybe promote Arabic food for
one day and promote the Greek food for one day. There's so many different
nationalities there and that way you'll be creating harmony. The Migrant
Resource Centre is doing heaps of work but for areas like that you've
got to invest heaps more to actually promote something. You can't just
base it on information sessions. You've got to create leisure activities
to get the people involved and to feel better about what they're doing.
I would personally target the younger generations so you can build their
trust initially. And not only in schools. On Refugee Day coming up we'll
have an information stall up in Liverpool just so that people can come
up and say hello and see that we don't have green blood after all.”

"The
media portrays a particular image of the Lebanese community. We need
to create a more positive image. Why don't we talk about all the positive
things we've done and achieved? That's where we should start.”

"Maybe
have some type of award to get people motivated and to show people that
we're not this bad image that the media's always portraying; we've also
got this positive side that people don't recognise.”

"We need
to get our people more educated to be tolerant, to be accepting and
where to go for help. And also educate the Westerners as well to know
that not all Muslims are what they say they are. Maybe a TV campaign
to promote everybody getting along.”

"I think
it's very important to educate the mainstream. There is very little
if anything taught on other cultures in the NSW education system. There's
a kit about Muslim women for secondary schools done by Dr Helen McHugh
which is very good. The Catholic schools in studies of religion are
doing quite a lot about Islam. In non-government schools there's much
less being done. We need to try to broaden the curriculum to make kids
understand what multiculturalism's all about. That there's not just
one variety of proper Australian. Then you've got to get to the broader
population. Really the only way to do that successfully is through the
media unless we're preaching to the converted. We need to get to those
who aren't tolerant, who don't know, don't particularly want to know,
and don't care. But who get very worried when John Howard says ‘be
alert not alarmed' and rush back to the fridge magnet. The only way
to do that is through the media.”

"The
concern that I have is that I don't think we should be isolating the
Muslims as such and saying look how different they are. We're getting
all this attention and the media's going beserk.”

"At a
personal level there needs to be matching of dialogue in one on ones
or in small groups to raise these issues. I don't think the platform
really matters or that it has to be done only in community organisations.
It has to be broader. For example I've consulted with law firms about
Muslim women's participation in the workforce. Women associates and
partners are quite open to the idea of employing women in hijab. But
their male peers are resistant and women are not breaking through their
domination and the male friendship thing. At that level of consulting
it's quite acceptable – you're opening up dialogue. There's a
different solution for each different audience. If it's done at the
micro level you can target a certain group. Reading a script is ok but
it's not really the essence of it. It's really getting into their mind
at an individual level and ask ‘what is it that worries you?'.
And learning from them their concerns and then addressing that. Then
you find that they come around really quickly because they find they
like you and they build up a dialogue and then they want you back for
some more. I really think that's how we're going to build friendships.
The institutional level strategies are going to take years and years.
I think you can run dual campaigns where you have the smaller micro
group as well as the macro.”

HREOC asked what role the ethnic media should play.

"The
ethnic media unfortunately is nothing but a true picture of its own
community. Being a business, like the mainstream, the ethnic media,
particularly newspapers need community support but also advertising,
promotions etc. We have half a million Australian Arab citizens here
but the Arabic language readership would only be maximum 1.5% of community.
Most don't read Arabic. Such a low number does not support half a dozen
newspapers in this country. When I was involved as publisher back in
1978-80, we went almost kissing the foot of those in control of government
advertising and we were given nothing. Why? Because we were telling
it as it is not how they wanted us to tell it. So in order for the ethnic
media to gain the dollar they have no other option but to follow the
politics of their masters.”

Providing community support

"I've
got to be given the feeling that I belong here. After 36 years I don't
feel that I belong here. I've made what I've made but by hard work not
handouts.”